Comments on LOST Theories: Richard isn't ageless by Salem

Wow, so now you have two names. You're turning in...

2009-11-13T19:28:23.919Z

Wow, so now you have two names. You're turning into a LOST character. I'm Phil by the way. Ok, so what the hell is this?
"You sound like one of those people how like bands because they are cool"
You have me so wrong. I'm the exact opposite. I hate bands that are "cool" unless I think they're cool. In fact, I really HATE most bands of today. All the bands I hear on the radio are horrible. College radio is the way to go. I went to see the Cranberries back in 99. My very first concert was Bush though. What was yours?
I wasn't able to find that Push on song. They must have taken it down. I am going to listen to the Originells tonight. Hahahaha. I'm assuming that my girl song isn't a cover of the classic if it was their hit. I meant to tell you, I think you're the first woman to like Back to the Future!! I've always wanted to meet one of those. What's your new theory about? I bet it's going to be another script size one ;) I've added you on facebook, so look out for me. I'm going to go practice my Rubik's times for a bit, but I'll talk to you later.

@errclaw. Have you introduced yourself at DarkUFO'...

2009-11-13T16:18:10.728Z

@errclaw. Have you introduced yourself at DarkUFO's facebook page or is it just a Lost page, I forget? There's a few people from here on it - Monika, Ricky, lost Dbutz to name a few. I am Christine Hardcastle so if you can find me on facebook - pop up and say hello. I am writing a new theory at the mo so I cannot talk too long.

The Call is a bit trendy rockpop kind band but they really do rock some of the classic rock songs and watching them live is very cool!

They did change their name and I wish I could remember it because it really was much better. They also changed their best track Push On and made it so commercial it didn't rock as much. It's still worth a listen and very catchy.

You sound like one of those people how like bands because they are cool! I am not shy to admit that I like tat or cheesy pop! I do like the Cranberries and Steriophonics and I been to Oasis concerts, I also like Ocean Colour Scene. I tend to like bits and bobs of everything though and I was TOTALLY into the House dance music scene!

see you on facebook or my new theory comments when I publish...

Cass -- just going to dip my toes in here. if Ric...

2009-11-13T15:42:33.800Z

Cass -- just going to dip my toes in here.

if Richard is himself an ontological paradox like Dbutz has always suggested like the watch Locke and he have been passing back and forth.... then when Richard says he is that way "because of him" he's more or less talking about Locke, not Jacob.

And part of me wonders if Flocke sets the whole thing up on purpose to doom Richard in this way -- and Richard has become aware of it.

So when Richard refers to "him" he's referring to Flocke or the Black shirt guy.

And if there is room to go on the motive here -- then Richard is basically aware of the fact that the Black shirt guy is trying to create these sewn up ontological paradoxes so that the people on the island cannot make changes via the island.

And by contrast, that would mean Jacob is trying to allow for changes -- reinforced by his "progress" statement.

So what we have here is a battle of fate vs free will from a magical island where it is indeed possible to change outcomes.

Motive is the last piece that needs more fleshing out -- Widmore, Ben, Hawking, Jacob, Black shirt... the whole bit. It will explain everything.

Season 6 cant get here soon enough.

Hahahhaa, I was going to say I didn't think you we...

2009-11-12T20:07:32.984Z

Hahahhaa, I was going to say I didn't think you were that old. (to be able to see the who with Keith) Ok, I listened to the call... a song called Missing Pieces, and I didn't like it. I knew I wouldn't right away, first when you told me the name of the band, and second as soon as I saw their website. I got the impression that they're one of those bands that put too much effort into naming their band to sound like a lot of other bands. Really, after I listened to it, it just sounded like a lot of other bands. That's not to say they weren't good though. I thought they were good, I just didn't like the song/style. AND HAHAHAHAHAHA, at your dad's band's name. Originells. I have to imagine the band is very nerdy guys trying to be "hip" hahahaha. I'll check that out tomorrow. Yeah, the music I make is both heavy and soft, but I'd never say that we were a heavy or soft band. I just tell people "rock." I like Heart and Queen, but not too many of those other bands. Although a couple of those others do have some good songs... I just won't admit to it. :) Do you like the cranberries? And no, I'm not like Marty McFly. I'm much spazzier. I am talking mental institutions should be waiting for me when I leave the gigs. And yea, I was thinking earlier that Dark might get mad at us :( SORRY DARK!! Are you on my space or facebook, or anything like that? I'll talk to you over there instead. It would actually be easier than trying to get to this page anyway hahahaha.

@ERRCLAW Yeah it wasn't the same without him! - Wh...

2009-11-12T16:38:25.098Z

@ERRCLAW Yeah it wasn't the same without him! - What am I saying - I've never seen them live with him!!! It was cool to listen to The Who songs but I wasn't that impressed. It was like watching my Dad on stage. Hey, if we are swapping music links then check out the band my Dad was in, The Originells and their hit My Girl - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3arVr345CI

I knew if I said that your band's music was soft rock I would risk the chance of offending you slightly ;-p! It wasn't intentional it was just my impression of the songs I listened to. I personally prefer softer rock and of course rock bands will play some soft and some heavier stuff. I was right that your music sounded American though!! "Wall riding and spazzing out" - reminds me of the scene in Back to the Future with Marty on the stage at the Enchantment Under the Sea dance, heeheehee!

I like such a wide range of music it's unreal. I love musicals! I love some serious rock and fun pop but my all time faves are Brian Adams, Heart, Voice of the Beehive, Queen, Abba, Dubstar, Morcheeba, Corrs, Dido.

The Call split for many reasons - mainly after they realised that they weren't going to "make it" and needed money, they had to look for real work. Other things came between them - some worked harder at the music than others. I have hope for the ones who are still at it but I've not heard their new stuff yet.

I am from Durham, half way between Newcastle and Sunderland but I live in Yorkshire now - you can still look in the same general direction from Cheshire though! I knew you were a binoculars kinda guy!!jkjk

I hope we don't get told off for chit-chatting here.

Yeah, but you saw the who minus Keith Moon. Not t...

2009-11-12T15:17:20.889Z

Yeah, but you saw the who minus Keith Moon. Not the same I'm sure. And yay!! I'm glad you liked it... but don't say soft rock, when you've only listened to those two songs!!!!! There are a few heavy songs there as well. You definitely wouldn't be saying soft if you'd seen us live. It was quite a rowdy show, where you would think I was going into seizures with my wall riding and guitar wrestling / spazzing out like I'm made with no bones.... I miss those days. Go listen to the first song, and the rest when you get a chance. When you're done listening to those, I'll give you your next assignment.
Ahh, so you're from the New Castle/Sunderland area? I live in Knutsford, Cheshire (Northwest) so I guess if I look out my east window with binoculars, I should be able to see you. I'm from New Jersey (USA) though. That's where the band was. :( I will go listen to the call and tell you what I think, but be warned... I'm very picky with music, and I will tell you straight out what I really think, so don't go getting all mad guy if I don't like it :) Why would they break up over not getting signed? That's the dumbest reason for a band to be together in the first place!! Getting signed sucks anymore. There's no future in it for a band nowadays. You're better off doing it yourself. There's almost no market for selling music in stores anymore... it's all mp3's now. Sad. Smack those guys on the back of the head and tell them they're supposed to play for fun. I was going to take some music to Chris Moyles at some point to see if he'd play it, but I never get to London, and sending it in the mail is almost useless. So, what are your favorite bands then? Most of my favorites are from the early 90's (Nirvana, soundgarden, etc...) but I do like a lot of 70's bands as well.

@ERRCLAW I did lsiten to it just now and I liked i...

2009-11-12T12:11:13.109Z

@ERRCLAW I did lsiten to it just now and I liked it so much I stayed on to listen to the next track. That's your band then? It sounds like American soft rock and those two songs Lost without the Gone and Miracles reminded me of Aerosmith Hero.

I am actually a Geordie so north east of England. My mates were in a band called The Call http://www.thecall.co.uk/music.html They split unfortunately after failing to get signed but some of them are still trying to make it. My fave track is Push On and although nowt to do with Lost if you like music it's worth a listen. They were on Radio 2 and played at quite a few gigs the most well known being O2 fesival a couple of years ago. If you look closely you can see me in one of the photo's! I was helping promote them at the O2 festival and we saw The Zutons and The Who for free!

@Monika - I think the fact that Richard sometimes ...

2009-11-12T10:41:12.402Z

@Monika - I think the fact that Richard sometimes appears ageless could be another indication that we are dealing with a show which is showing us different iterations of the timeline. In one timeline maybe Richard is clueless. Therefore the scene we watched where he appeared clueless was a snippet of a timeline where Richard is clueless. The thing is that if we are right in this idea (that there are different iterations all mixed in together) then it does get messy for the writers to show us which timeline matches which set of scenes. Have you seen a theory some guy wrote on here which showed how to identify the different iterations with finger markers - did you see that one? I forget what it was called now but it included a link to his website and how he thought that there are 4 iterations of the timeline which are indicated by the number of fingers the actors/characters are holding up - seems a bit far fetched or could it be brilliant. On the flip side - maybe we don't need to be shown exactly which scene is relevant to which iteration because we already have clues like the Richard is clueless idea and all of the other inconsistencies chalked up as continuity errors.

The thing is though I would rather put it down to the fact that Richard just isn't giving the game away for 1) not telling us the viewer and 2)not wanting to tell the Losties the island's secrets or give the opposite team in the war the upper hand. If there are several people running about the island some having "future knowledge" - those flashes of the future John and Des have - then maybe those people could be being influenced by either Jacob or MIB and Richard doesn't know who to trust so that's why he is so secretive and only seems clueless.

They keep saying that.... people are special, what...

2009-11-11T20:41:15.661Z

They keep saying that.... people are special, whatever.... but they never say how. Like, why/how/in what way are they special?

Richard saw the first light, like all other Others...

2009-11-11T20:06:37.857Z

Richard saw the first light, like all other Others..and he confirmed that later..it was the initial light..but later on he was clueless..all of them except for Des and Losties. Why? Who knows..
But I think they are all special...Desmond, Sawyer, Locke, Kate, Jack, Sun, Jin, Hurley...etc.

Oh, and did you listen to my song?

2009-11-11T19:31:57.983Z

Oh, and did you listen to my song?

QUOTE Desmond seemed to also see the light when Fa...

2009-11-11T19:30:21.244Z

QUOTE
Desmond seemed to also see the light when Farday knocked on the hatch and then disappeared... no one else other than the "time-flashers"... and Desmond

Actually, this is mostly true, but remember the season 4 finale, when the island vanished, Richard also saw the light right before John disappeared. This has always bugged me. And Cass, I do now understand what you mean. I kind of thought the same thing. But, the failsafe light, Darlton confirmed that the island did not move during that. Where are you from by the way? You say words don't sound right sometimes when you speak....

About the Richard comment on the rust - yes I thin...

2009-11-11T15:41:20.573Z

About the Richard comment on the rust - yes I think it's a big clue. Now I know a metaphor is not a joke but could the comments the writers made about this being a metaphor be refering to some bigger idea here.

Yeah I remember people saying he seemed to see the light but I cannot quite rememer the scene exactly - did Des squint his eyes? He covered his eyes didn't he with his arm? Now why would Des be different??? It's not the exposure to the Em as I thought because Locke and Eko were in the vacinity and also we've seen our Losties at another blast site? So what make him different, why, why,why?

@Cass, on the flashes and stuff... just something ...

2009-11-11T15:31:11.411Z

@Cass, on the flashes and stuff... just something else to think about:

Desmond seemed to also see the light when Farday knocked on the hatch and then disappeared... no one else other than the "time-flashers"... and Desmond. Des is an exception- so what do that mean?

Also, whent eh failsafe key was turned that caused the island to breifly be visable to the outside world. Remember Jack-looking-chess-playing-eskimo who called Penny...

I'm not really sure what you're getting at yet with the time flash EM stuff...but I just those two facts came to mind, maybe the help support or develope your idea.

And about the Brass, yeah somethign about was naggin' me, which was the reason for the all caps, but I couldn't put my finger on it- that was all you. =)

So since it was brass, was Richard just being facitious when he said "a little rusty but she can still find north?"

Sorry I should have phrased it better, when spoken...

2009-11-11T14:58:09.629Z

Sorry I should have phrased it better, when spoken aloud with inflection it would have come across as I meant it to sound. I didn't want to ask you a question as in I didn't know the answer and I didn't want to spell it out because that would look like I was telling you what you already know. I was trying to get your agreement. I'll say it again a different way coz I write as I speak and that doesn't always come across well written down!

I believe that those flashes were because the people were separated from the island and they could see time changing around them. The EM was escaping somehow within the island causing it to change about them or to move them through time. It was about them, engulfing them almost. If the island was moving though time then it would be the island that would be engulfed with EM and not seen within. The only reason they saw the white light after the fail safe key was turned was because EM came out from under the Swan and escaped within the bubble.

One idea is that at that point (when we saw the white light after the failsafe key was turned) the world ended and time reset. The story that continued after the white light was a different timeline where the implosion of the Swan did not have the same impact, all realities converging on the island etc, etc.

Whatever, but the point is (I think - eek) is that when the Losties moved in time with the island in series 1, they wouldn't have seen any escaping EM it was engulfing the island causing it to move. Or rather not just the EM is the bubble which has been created but a bubble which was created since EM and radiation converge to create the time travelling bubble. I'm crazy, Neoloki's right! I'm just fitting things in for my own theories - fun innit!!

@Cass.... " were the flashes just for people going...

2009-11-11T14:17:36.850Z

@Cass.... " were the flashes just for people going from one time to another though on the island when they became separated from it?"

I am confused by this series of words.... hahaha, I'm not sure what you're asking me. And....

"The flashes of the island moving would have been outside of the bubble perhaps? It was an indication of release of EM wasn't it - the white flashes?"

Nooo, why would the flashes just have been outside the bubble?!?! They were all over during season 5!! UGH, I WANT TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS NOWWWWW!!!! I don't even know when Lost starts!!!! It was so easy when I lived in the US, but now I'm in the UK and can't get a straight answer about when it starts. grrr.

@Errclaw, were the flashes just for people going f...

2009-11-11T14:03:07.566Z

@Errclaw, were the flashes just for people going from one time to another though on the island when they became separated from it? The flashes of the island moving would have been outside of the bubble perhaps? It was an indication of release of EM wasn't it - the white flashes?

@Elegiamore. You said, "Hey, I just remembered tha...

2009-11-11T14:00:16.502Z

@Elegiamore. You said, "Hey, I just remembered that Eko's staff has something about "looking north" carved on it, which was meant for John to read, as it landed in front of him at some point.

Could the Eko "look north" message a reference to the compass/Richard/Locke/moving in time loop, telling us that this activity is an important clue/message to John about his destiny?"

Yes, I think there could have been more to it but at the time I think it was directions to find the barracks or something wasn't it?

@Katelyn and everyone. Katelyn - I thought it was ...

2009-11-11T13:56:18.993Z

@Katelyn and everyone. Katelyn - I thought it was your idea about the brass thing - hahhahah- I thought that's what you must have been saying when you said BRASS in capitals. I was thinking I must look that up to see what she means (my husband being a recycling scrap metal worker there was something nagging me about properties of BRASS) then low and behold I discover that brass doesn't rust. Now if you were planing a loophole using time travel and you wanted to confuse the issue, one might use a brass object so it would not be detected as an ontological paradox by your oponent.

What if there are 2 or 3 loops (of people going back in time and changing things and only 2/3 timelines, not many worlds but just as many timelines as there are differences - one set of differences from a time travel trip for example) and John has two compasses as a result of accepting two from Richard on different occations?

Is that totally absurd? Do you see what I mean? Consider if the island is at the centre of all the possible timelines a place where all converge perhaps. When Locke came to the island he would not have had a compass because he didn't identify the compass from Richard and therefore didn't own it or bring it to the island but when he gets to the island he has 2 because in the other two realities he did accept the compass. Could we be watching the many worlds idea in it's development? The island is where all possibilities can exist at once. I've said something similar to this before...I just keep coming back to the idea that at the moment we are just seeing 3 timelines. TimelineI where Faraday researches the correct frequency of his machine to send his rat's consciousness to the future, timelineII where he receives the info from Des and then instead of working on that he works on Constants and then he says before he dies he needs to research Variables as if that's the next thing he should do in the next iteration of the timeline. So I am back again to my idea that Dan knows that the incident resets time and creates another timeline - maybe to the start of time maybe just a tangent from that point in time...

Ahhh, now I HAVE got a nose bleed!

Oh, and I've always wondered, if the island was al...

2009-11-11T13:53:00.275Z

Oh, and I've always wondered, if the island was always moving in season 1 and that's why they were never found, why were there never any flashes? That doesn't make any sense. I hope they come up with an excuse for that.

@Cass- No, hahahaha, I think your name is awesome ...

2009-11-11T13:42:17.482Z

@Cass- No, hahahaha, I think your name is awesome because of pudding. I think you're awesome because you really have a lot of good ideas and a lot to say about them to back them up, and seem really smart, which is hard to see in people these days. And, now I think you're awesome because it seems you may have OCD since you're repeating words, which I do, and do that all the time at the end of a sentence.... only, not when I'm typing :) And yeah, I play/write music. I have been since 92. There are 6 songs on my myspace, but one of them is about LOST. However, when I wrote it, it was during season 4, so my knowledge compared to what I know now, was limited. Hope you like :)

@Jack and Kate plus 8. Ooo, why do you think Des i...

2009-11-11T13:24:32.035Z

@Jack and Kate plus 8. Ooo, why do you think Des is out of the loop - how do you think he became so?

@errclaw. You think I'm awesome because my screen ...

2009-11-11T13:23:31.490Z

@errclaw. You think I'm awesome because my screen name sounds like a pudding???!!?? Hahaha. Lost certainly inspires a lot of art - music you've written - I will check that out.

I love the idea that the island is going from one ...

2009-11-11T12:35:40.520Z

I love the idea that the island is going from one timeline to another, as you mention above neoloki, and as in a new theory to come to this site about the video tapes. I do think that's what I'm getting at when the island time travels because I'm also saying that the Others have been changing the past and a new timeline is created each time someone goes back in time or there's the possibility that a major paradox resets time and then changes are made in the new iteration. Then the island can traverse through those different options of the timeline, one where Locke is dead and the other he's alive. There are not an infinate number of options though as in the many worlds idea and not that the universe has split many times. There is one new timeline which is created from one of those two events I mentioned 1)a time travel expedition 2)a major paradox resets time to create a new timeline.

@neoloki I like the idea that Richard is an ontolo...

2009-11-11T12:10:40.688Z

@neoloki I like the idea that Richard is an ontological paradox. Would that mean, though that he was never born and just appeared - isn't that the general gist of an object in an ontological paradox? Good thoughts. In a way it brings us back to the discussion about him being frozen in time because he's time travelling but it's quite different. In this case I feel it's a way of getting round the idea and a bit of poetic licence in a way - call Richard an ontologic paradox and he's ageless because he never exists but he does, hmmmm