“He said that some very bad things happened, and that it was my fault, and that I needed to come back.” - Jack
Most seem to believe that Jack was speaking of dark times on the island. I interpret that quotation in a different way…but I’ll get to that later.
Let’s go back to season 1 where we were introduced to the others. The Others appeared to be the “bad guys” and a bearded Tom seemed the apparent leader. Then in season 2, in Three Minutes, we were introduced to Bea Klugh who seemed very much in charge. Then in Live Together, Die Alone it becomes apparent that Henry Gale, aka Ben Linus, is the actual leader. Throughout season 3 it was becoming increasingly obvious that Benjamin is the primary antagonist and the real “bad guy.” On May 9, 2007, in The Man Behind the Curtain, a cabin dwelling man by the name of Jacob comes flying at us from left field. Now Jacob seems to the leader of the hated others and the “bad guy.” Then season 4 comes along and we realize the others aren’t even the bad guys, Charles Widmore is…..one would assume. It’s safe to say the writers of L O S T enjoy providing their viewers with a false sense of authority.
If you are convinced that Widmore is the antagonist, ponder a bit more about The Shape of Things to Come. The two rivals, Ben and Widmore, are humanized in this episode. Ben is seen crying over the body of his fallen daughter. Now, in the final seen we see Widmore. Widmore appears a frail old man, sleeping with a bottle of scotch because of nightmares. Does Widmore give the impression of a ruthless villain? Absolutely not.
Why would Ben or Charles Widmore go to the trouble of putting a fake 815 at the bottom of the ocean?
Why would Sayid be assassinating employees of Widmore and “economists” if Ben can easily access the key to Charles Widmore’s Penthouse?
These are the operative questions.
“Because whoever put that plane at the bottom of the ocean wanted someone to think we’re dead.” - Jack
Whoever was responsible for the fake 815 at the bottom of the ocean, they didn’t want someONE to find the real one.
So why would Jack be responsible for these bad events? It’s not simply because he left the island and “he wasn’t supposed to.” Free will still exists, the island can’t completely control you, just influence you. By leaving the island and going home, Jack opened a “Pandora’s box” if you will. A third party is now aware of the 815ers’ existence. Think about it, there are people trying to kill Sayid, people perched outside of Hurley’s room, and Locke “committed suicide.” If you feel Widmore is responsible for this don’t you think his attitude toward Sun would have been just a little bit less friendly?
“There were no survivors!” - Matthew Abaddon
Abaddon is a member of the third party.
In Confirmed Dead, Abaddon is convinced there were no survivors of Oceanic 815. He assigns Naomi an unknown task in what appears to be an abandoned office building. If he worked for Widmore and shared common interests, would it be necessary to meet with Naomi in such a secluded place?
So what bad things did Jack cause? The bad events weren’t on the island. Abaddon was convinced there were no survivors of 815. In the Beginning of the End he gives Hurley a spine chilling “Are they still alive?” This third party now knows of at least seven people (I’m including Locke) who recently inhabited the island and they’re going to do what it takes to find it.
By now I’m sure you’re wondering who I think this third party is. I’ll say this, If Matthew Abaddon had brought his business card in The Beginning of the End, it would have said The Hanso Foundation.
Theory by Matt4
Most seem to believe that Jack was speaking of dark times on the island. I interpret that quotation in a different way…but I’ll get to that later.
Let’s go back to season 1 where we were introduced to the others. The Others appeared to be the “bad guys” and a bearded Tom seemed the apparent leader. Then in season 2, in Three Minutes, we were introduced to Bea Klugh who seemed very much in charge. Then in Live Together, Die Alone it becomes apparent that Henry Gale, aka Ben Linus, is the actual leader. Throughout season 3 it was becoming increasingly obvious that Benjamin is the primary antagonist and the real “bad guy.” On May 9, 2007, in The Man Behind the Curtain, a cabin dwelling man by the name of Jacob comes flying at us from left field. Now Jacob seems to the leader of the hated others and the “bad guy.” Then season 4 comes along and we realize the others aren’t even the bad guys, Charles Widmore is…..one would assume. It’s safe to say the writers of L O S T enjoy providing their viewers with a false sense of authority.
If you are convinced that Widmore is the antagonist, ponder a bit more about The Shape of Things to Come. The two rivals, Ben and Widmore, are humanized in this episode. Ben is seen crying over the body of his fallen daughter. Now, in the final seen we see Widmore. Widmore appears a frail old man, sleeping with a bottle of scotch because of nightmares. Does Widmore give the impression of a ruthless villain? Absolutely not.
Why would Ben or Charles Widmore go to the trouble of putting a fake 815 at the bottom of the ocean?
Why would Sayid be assassinating employees of Widmore and “economists” if Ben can easily access the key to Charles Widmore’s Penthouse?
These are the operative questions.
“Because whoever put that plane at the bottom of the ocean wanted someone to think we’re dead.” - Jack
Whoever was responsible for the fake 815 at the bottom of the ocean, they didn’t want someONE to find the real one.
So why would Jack be responsible for these bad events? It’s not simply because he left the island and “he wasn’t supposed to.” Free will still exists, the island can’t completely control you, just influence you. By leaving the island and going home, Jack opened a “Pandora’s box” if you will. A third party is now aware of the 815ers’ existence. Think about it, there are people trying to kill Sayid, people perched outside of Hurley’s room, and Locke “committed suicide.” If you feel Widmore is responsible for this don’t you think his attitude toward Sun would have been just a little bit less friendly?
“There were no survivors!” - Matthew Abaddon
Abaddon is a member of the third party.
In Confirmed Dead, Abaddon is convinced there were no survivors of Oceanic 815. He assigns Naomi an unknown task in what appears to be an abandoned office building. If he worked for Widmore and shared common interests, would it be necessary to meet with Naomi in such a secluded place?
So what bad things did Jack cause? The bad events weren’t on the island. Abaddon was convinced there were no survivors of 815. In the Beginning of the End he gives Hurley a spine chilling “Are they still alive?” This third party now knows of at least seven people (I’m including Locke) who recently inhabited the island and they’re going to do what it takes to find it.
By now I’m sure you’re wondering who I think this third party is. I’ll say this, If Matthew Abaddon had brought his business card in The Beginning of the End, it would have said The Hanso Foundation.
Theory by Matt4
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23 Comments:
FINALLY, a theory. this is great. i've been trying to figure out who abaddon is working with/for. he's the secret for the future episodes.
I've got many mixed ideas about Abaddon. First of all, his name is a theological reference to the angel of the underworld, which made me think that Abaddon is more than just a man, but a spirit that once ruled the island.
There is also the scene with Locke and Abaddon in Cabin Fever. Abaddon called him "Mr.Locke," which is the same thing Walt called him. Abaddon also talked about going on a walkabout and "finding out who he was." So who is he? This mixes in with the first part, but I'm adding the twist that Walt is Abaddon. After Walt went on his walkabout he learned that he is the reincarnation of the Angel that guards the Island, which is the underworld. He also said that Locke would owe him one next time he sees him. Didn't Locke teach Walt to close his eyes and trow the knife, which was Walt's first communion with the island?
A final thought, perhaps Abaddon's business card would have read "Paik Industries." Paik wants the island too, as his company did contracting work for Hanso, just like Widmore Industries, to build that hatches and towers. Paik also made sure Jin came on the island with his watch, which I think was intended to help him locate the island.
Nice one!
I definitely agree that season 5 will prove Widmore to be less shady that implied in Season 4 and a far more threatening figure will be revealed (whether that be Abaddon or not). Who is 'good' and who is 'bad' is one of the central themes to Lost.
You've got me thinking now about the pattern of each season; ying and yang/black and white. With each turn themes and characters flip from good/bad, faith/science.
The other central theme the apparent contrast between 'nature' and 'technology', the others and Darhma. The island itself is the ultimate expression of nature. John Locke personifies it when he says it speaks to him. It is alive. Darhma is contrast has implanted the stations into it's 'skin' and tried to extract it's power. The frozen donkey wheel shows the deeper extent of the islands power. I refer to the theory 'Polar Bears, Island Movement, and the Mothership' by Keeping Pace which discusses the island being an alien ship. Overlooking the 'alien' part of this, it is interesting to consider that the island is a piece of technology in it's own right. I think this fits into the 'flipping' of the themes. The island as the ultimate representation of nature is likely to be revealed in season 5 as the greatest piece of technology we've seen yet, far greater than anything Darhma could come up with...
I can totally get on board with this. TPTB have said that Abbadon is not 'top of the chain' or something similar which hinted he works for someone more powerful. I believe it's too late in the game to introduce a brand new 'ultimate bad guy' so someone like Hanso, who's name is synonymous with Lost would be perfect.
I think Abbadon may even have turned the infamous wheel once upon a time. The way he pointed Locke and later, Faraday and co. in the direction of the island seems like the actions of someone who has to remain on the outside looking in but who isn't adverse to ushering others inside.
I SO happen to like this theory. I personally believe Mr. Widmore was trying to get Ben brought back alive so that they could work together against "the real enemy". Great job.
I like and agree with T.L.A. in that Abaddon is someone who can't be on the island himself, much like Ben now can't. I just don't understand why. But I'm sure we'll be told.
Anyhow, my major gripe with the "Mr Locke" thing that Lost Dbutz (and many other fans) brought up? THAT'S HIS NAME. Though we call him simply "Locke", "Mr Locke" is not actually that an unusual thing to call him, if you think about it. Maybe if it were "Mr John" (as in how Sam called Frodo "Mr Frodo' in LotR), then it'd be a reference, but it's not. It's just a title and then the surname. Not weird at all.
It isn't a reference to Walt, it's simply what a helper at a hospital would formally refer to a patient as if they were not professionally close.
My GP's receptionist calls me Mr Sparkes all the time. My GP calls me Andrew. If I were to need a wheelchair and a random employee was pushing me, to be fair, I'd feel kind of weird if they started calling me by my first name without even knowing me.
That's all it is. Formality in a professional environment.
As for the original theory? Great work. There aren't many big faults with it and even those small creases can be ironed out (Hanso had links with Paik, but that doesn't mean Paik has to be in on Hanso's evil plans, for example).
But didn't Widmore send the freighter? Anyone simply "saying" Widmore sent the freighter could be lying, but Gault and Keamy talking about Widmore and the secondary protocol kind of proves Widmore really DID send the freighter. The freighter with Naomi and 4 "specialists" handpicked by Abaddon aboard.
The only way it will work is if Abaddon has a job with Widmore (undercover for Hanso) and secretly put Naomi and friends on board without Widmore knowing. But to get it to work, there definitely has to be a link between Abaddon and Widmore, even if Abaddon is ultimately working for someone else (Hanso).
gribfritz...
Widmore definitely sent the freighter. But he didn't pick everyone on board.
I think Naomi was a Widmore-hired gal and was simply checking in with Abaddon to see who HE put on the boat. Kinda like Widmore's chief-of-staff on the boat checking with the person Widmore outsourced some employing to. Makes more sense that way, as she was actually pretty unimportant to the story, as was Keamy (besides being an arsehole, he didn't have any huge mysteries/hook about him, which shows how great a job the actor did at keeping us gripped every week), Gault, Omar, Regina, Minowski, etc.
It's the four that Abaddon picked that have the weird stuff going on: Charlotte and her home; Miles and his ghosts; Daniel and his time-travel research; Frank and his beard. Being serious though, I think Frank will have to go back with the Oceanic 6, ironically eventually piloting a flight to the island himself, perhaps?
I think the episode in which we see Sun discuss her plans with Widmore will be a Widmore flashback. In that flashback, we will see Abaddon himself use a similar tactic of common goals to book out four places on the freighter. That's all it'd take for this theory to be viable.
there is absolutely NO WAY that walt and Abaddon are the same person. that's the most insane thing I've heard.
they look nothing alike, besides the fact that they're both black, and Abaddon talks with an English accent.
otherwise, the other theory is good. it has a few holes, but what theory doesn't?
I like the idea that there is a greater "villian" behind this whole thing.
Another reason why Walt cannot be Abaddon. They both exist at the same time.
Great theory about Abaddon. There is much more to him than simply being Widmore's employee.
He is, at the very least, a double-agent. I'm not quite sure who else he is working for. Hanso? Don't know what that adds to the story at this point.
But there are a few curious things about him that support this theory, at least in part:
- He put the 3 scientists and Frank on the island, much to Naomi's displeasure;
- His conversation with Locke in "Cabin Fever": he tells him that he experienced a miracle (I'm paraphrasing). What is he referring to?
- His visit to Hurley and his question "are they alive". Who? The scientists?
All of the scenes contradict much of we have seen/know so far. So yes, I agree, there is someone else involved in all of this and Abaddon is part of it.
okay so i like this theory very much, thouogh i do have a couple of issues:
~ i dont think the writers will leave a simple explanation of good and bad at the end of the show, i think there will be areas of grey, and for there to be one "bad" entity doesn't strike me as LOST writing
~ abaddon clearly has a "good" side to him as he wants locke to go to the island, and since locke is the saviour of the people in a sense, why would he want that if he was the "bad" entity?
~ widmore and hanso seem connected from the previous videos, and both seem to be aiding the dharma initiative, im less inclined to believe it is hanso as that would tie widmore to the equation, and more likely to believe that either its neither, or that hanso and widmore aren't directly related in dharma (or even that widmore left dharma due to hansos fuck ups or something of the sort)
~ lastly, abaddon chose scientists and not mercenaries to get on the frieghter, which maeks me believe he may not be as bad as you imply
Any particular reason this is 4.33 and got taken out of the top theories?
No idea Matt, I'll contact the developers.
Thanks dark.
"~ abaddon clearly has a "good" side to him as he wants locke to go to the island, and since locke is the saviour of the people in a sense, why would he want that if he was the "bad" entity?"
I don't understand how people think that Locke being on the island was a good thing?
Meant to happen? Yes.
Good? Still to be seen.
For all we know, the island has been using Locke just as he's been used throughout his life.
Abaddon obviously knew of this weakness and gave him a shred of hope. It is the sign of a manipulator (never a good thing).
Locke being on the island killed him. Had Abaddon not made him go to the island, he'd still be alive.
Tell me, in Locke's eyes, how this is a good thing?
what if sticking with this time travel thing, what if abaddon works for locke. locke in the past or future or whatever recruited abaddon and told him of events that were soon to come. like desmond did with penny. and after a few events start happening u have to believe. so maybe locke sent abaddon to himself in the physical therapy place to make sure he goes on the walkabout.
remember daniel to desmond to tell him sumthin about his mouse so he would believe. abaddon told locke of the walkabout to give him faith. then he sent abaddon to head up the team on the frieghter to get ben off the island and leave him to be the leader.
its a stretch but good theories get the mind jogging dont it?
and i think locke loves the island and his master plan is to make jack suffer thru life the way he did so he would accept the role of the islands leader. he even would go so far as to let jack escape and commit suicide to get jack to fullfill his destiny
jin-sushi : I really like your idea about Locke and Abaddon. Quite clever.
I would love to get a few of the top theorists from all-over together in a room to brain-storm (now in the hiatus between 4/5). And record the event ...and then get them all together again to watch the finale episode and see their faces as it plays out.
to andrew:
Why is Locke coming to island good?
1 - For Locke himself, so far, it seems he is much much happier on the island than in real life. Whether or not abaddon is influencing the terrible things that happened to him off the island doesn't change the fact, that atleast he himself, is currently happier on the island (i'll expand on this in a bit)
2 - Locke tried to prevent the O6 from leaving a whole bunch of times (submarine, asking jack directly, etc...) which we now know wasn't supposed to happen, so he was trying to making a positive influence which is never a bad thing.
3 - Locke tried to prevent the frieghter from reaching which would've saved countless lives and wouldn't have let the O6 leave the island which is another good thing.
4 - Locke was able to walk again. I am inclined to believe most people think walking is a good idea.
5 - Locke was able to deal with his father/supposed father once and for all, which TO LOCKE, once again is a good thing.
I feel I've made a pretty compelling case. I do agree with you, however, that Locke is probably being manipulated, and I foresee him realizing this in season 6, and stepping up and ending people using him once and for all towards the end of the show.
I'm also sure the logic of "manipulater is never a good thing" is absolutely rubbish. Ben, Sawyer, Sayid and a whole bunch of people have manipulated people for the "greater good" throughout the show, which is a huge theme. I'm sure you aren't going to say sayid and sawyer, at the very least, are bad people.
I also having a feeling that Locke is infact the saviour of the people, and i am quite confident he will be ressurrected.
When we say good, remember that "good" for Locke and "good" for the island may be two different things.
My entire point, is that to say that calling abaddon outright "BAD" or "EVIL" is too simplistic, and even if it is true, and there are no concrete redeeming qualities for abaddon, I'll be pretty upset with the end of the show. lost has always been about areas of grey despite 'black' and 'white' and good/evil themes, the entire point is that it is never clear cut.
peace